[Discussion] Common crossbreed myths https://ift.tt/eA8V8J This is just a general discussion post about crossbred dogs, based in part on my experiences with them. If you've seen me kicking around the subreddit, you probably know that I'm pretty open to purposeful crossbreeding, and even mixed breeding, if it is done well. But a lot of times, it's not (the same is true of purebred breedings tbh but that's another post). I've seen a recent uptick in crossbred litters in my area, and a lot of the ads promise the same things: The best attributes of each breed Hybrid vigour (or "healthier than a purebred") A way to own X breed in Y form On the surface, these promises are attractive, so I think it's worthwhile to push back at the logic underpinning each of these assertions so that people can make informed decisions about the dogs they bring home. Also I'm trying to avoid work at the moment. A crossbred dog will inherit the best attributes of each parent breed. Man do I wish this was true. And is it ever marketed like you can control genetic distribution: the Doodle world is particularly bad for leaning on Poodle coat inheritance as an attractive feature of the cross. But we know genetics don't work like that -- did you inherit the best attributes of your parents? If you did, lucky you. But most of us probably wound up with crooked teeth, or shoddy eyesight, or a tendency towards anxiety, or any of the myriad other traits our parents rolled the dice on. Dog breeding isn't any different. In fact, one of the upsides of purebred breeding is a rather limited variation in traits (but sometimes at the expense of genetic diversity). But when you're dealing in crosses, now you've got two breed gene pools to contend with. Does that mean that every cross will be a random mishmash of genetic inheritance? No, not really. In the horse world, you can sometimes register a horse as a certain breed if it looks like and performs like that breed, no closed studbook necessary (Quarter Horses, for example). But when you cross, generally, what you're looking at instead is a wider spectrum of traits to contend with: the Poodle coat AND the Lab coat, the Great Pyr suspicion of strangers AND the Golden's sociability. How those traits shake out in reality is different for each individual puppy, even puppies in a litter. It's why an F2 cross (Doodle to Doodle) will likely produce a high degree of variety between littermates: you now have two Lab lines and two Poodle lines to contend with. That's where things start getting dicey. In a cross between relatively similar breeds -- let's say Labs and Goldens -- the spectrum of traits you'd expect to see is a little less expansive than a cross between relatively dissimilar breeds, like maybe a Livestock Guardian Dog and a Sighthound. Wouldn't it be great if you could get a leaner bodied but still hardy dog, with some Borzoi sweetness and LGD fearlessness? But what if instead you got a really fast and really antisocial dog who only wants to hang out with sheep and sometimes chase them around? Which leads me to Crosses benefit from hybrid vigour and are healthier than purebreds Again a marketing quip that particularly unscrupulous breeders of crosses love to tout. If you have two breeds with little overlap in health concerns -- let's say one breed with MDR1 as a concern and the other without -- you're unlikely to run into an issue with MDR1 *to start*. But if both breeds can have MDR1, you'd best be testing the parent generations to ensure you aren't breeding carriers and affecteds. The logic that breeding two different breeds together always results in healthier offspring is a pretty clever way for some breeders of crosses to avoid health testing their stock. Using BorderPaps as an example, OFA.org recommends individuals of both breeds have their eyes examined -- Paps every other year, BCs yearly until the age of seven. Knowing this, if you were pursuing a BorderPap, you'd be wise to insist that the parents had had their eyes tested despite them being different breeds. Actually, you'd be wise to verify that both parents received the complete spectrum of health testing for their respective breeds. I can't tell you how many large breed to large breed crosses I worked with who had hip dysplasia. Or food allergies. Or skin issues. The fact that they have parents of two different breeds did not make them immune to heritable health issues. There are a lot of overlaps among purebred dogs when it comes to health issues, so crossing is not a guarantee of good health. Does that mean that purebred dogs are healthier than crossbred dogs? Nope. Lots of people in that world skip on health testing too. Diligence and information is your friend in either case. And finally, A cross lets you have X breed in Y form This is similar to the first point about inheriting the best traits. Usually I see this idea framed around size: mini Huskies, mini Rotties, mini Mastiffs (that one's a mindbender). The Pomsky as a "mini husky" is a good example of this -- all the sass and character of the Husky in a much easier to catch and contain body. This logic often accompanies breedings between vastly different dogs, usually with the aim of using one breed's size as a goal with the other breed's temperament. Sport cross breedings can fall into this trap: the brains of the BC with the smaller structure of the Papillon. But sometimes you get neither of those things. Or you get a weak-kneed, neurotic BorderPap who is 18lbs and 15.5" at the shoulder, and still has to run in a more competitive class in agility. At that point, a Sheltie might have been a better choice. Like I said, I'm not against purposeful crossing or mixing, but I am against shoddy breeding and predatory marketing. I had to learn these lessons with my first dog, a GSD x Golden who loved people, hated other dogs, and had itchy skin, a bad gut, and sore hips all his life. Genetics play a huge role in temperament, structure, and health. If you are considering a cross, ask yourself: is the breeder doing the recommended health testing on the parent dogs? what promises about the cross are being made? what does the cross improve on from the parent breeds? what is the purpose for the cross? Unfortunately, you are unlikely to find many cross breeders investing in health testing, demonstrating their dogs' attributes, or offering much in the way of buyer support. That doesn't mean they don't exist, but it does mean that finding one is going to take a lot more work than finding a purebred breeder hitting those marks. If you are looking at shelter dogs, it's also worthwhile considering the breeds assessed as being part of the dog's makeup. Breed guesses are low accuracy for the most part, but if you see a dog marked as a "Lab x Anatolian", it's worth asking yourself if you'd be willing to deal with a dog who might have inherited the least ideal traits of two very dissimilar breeds. Anyway, back to work for me. Thanks for reading. dogs ardenbucket

This is just a general discussion post about crossbred dogs, based in part on my experiences with them. If you've seen me kicking around the subreddit, you probably know that I'm pretty open to purposeful crossbreeding, and even mixed breeding, if it is done well. But a lot of times, it's not (the same is true of purebred breedings tbh but that's another post). I've seen a recent uptick in crossbred litters in my area, and a lot of the ads promise the same things:

• The best attributes of each breed
• Hybrid vigour (or "healthier than a purebred")
• A way to own X breed in Y form

On the surface, these promises are attractive, so I think it's worthwhile to push back at the logic underpinning each of these assertions so that people can make informed decisions about the dogs they bring home. Also I'm trying to avoid work at the moment.

1. A crossbred dog will inherit the best attributes of each parent breed.

Man do I wish this was true. And is it ever marketed like you can control genetic distribution: the Doodle world is particularly bad for leaning on Poodle coat inheritance as an attractive feature of the cross. But we know genetics don't work like that -- did you inherit the best attributes of your parents? If you did, lucky you. But most of us probably wound up with crooked teeth, or shoddy eyesight, or a tendency towards anxiety, or any of the myriad other traits our parents rolled the dice on. Dog breeding isn't any different. In fact, one of the upsides of purebred breeding is a rather limited variation in traits (but sometimes at the expense of genetic diversity).

But when you're dealing in crosses, now you've got two breed gene pools to contend with. Does that mean that every cross will be a random mishmash of genetic inheritance? No, not really. In the horse world, you can sometimes register a horse as a certain breed if it looks like and performs like that breed, no closed studbook necessary (Quarter Horses, for example). But when you cross, generally, what you're looking at instead is a wider spectrum of traits to contend with: the Poodle coat AND the Lab coat, the Great Pyr suspicion of strangers AND the Golden's sociability. How those traits shake out in reality is different for each individual puppy, even puppies in a litter. It's why an F2 cross (Doodle to Doodle) will likely produce a high degree of variety between littermates: you now have two Lab lines and two Poodle lines to contend with.

That's where things start getting dicey. In a cross between relatively similar breeds -- let's say Labs and Goldens -- the spectrum of traits you'd expect to see is a little less expansive than a cross between relatively dissimilar breeds, like maybe a Livestock Guardian Dog and a Sighthound. Wouldn't it be great if you could get a leaner bodied but still hardy dog, with some Borzoi sweetness and LGD fearlessness? But what if instead you got a really fast and really antisocial dog who only wants to hang out with sheep and sometimes chase them around?

Which leads me to

1. Crosses benefit from hybrid vigour and are healthier than purebreds

Again a marketing quip that particularly unscrupulous breeders of crosses love to tout. If you have two breeds with little overlap in health concerns -- let's say one breed with MDR1 as a concern and the other without -- you're unlikely to run into an issue with MDR1 *to start*. But if both breeds can have MDR1, you'd best be testing the parent generations to ensure you aren't breeding carriers and affecteds.

The logic that breeding two different breeds together always results in healthier offspring is a pretty clever way for some breeders of crosses to avoid health testing their stock. Using BorderPaps as an example, OFA.org recommends individuals of both breeds have their eyes examined -- Paps every other year, BCs yearly until the age of seven. Knowing this, if you were pursuing a BorderPap, you'd be wise to insist that the parents had had their eyes tested despite them being different breeds. Actually, you'd be wise to verify that both parents received the complete spectrum of health testing for their respective breeds.

I can't tell you how many large breed to large breed crosses I worked with who had hip dysplasia. Or food allergies. Or skin issues. The fact that they have parents of two different breeds did not make them immune to heritable health issues. There are a lot of overlaps among purebred dogs when it comes to health issues, so crossing is not a guarantee of good health. Does that mean that purebred dogs are healthier than crossbred dogs? Nope. Lots of people in that world skip on health testing too. Diligence and information is your friend in either case.

And finally,

1. A cross lets you have X breed in Y form

This is similar to the first point about inheriting the best traits. Usually I see this idea framed around size: mini Huskies, mini Rotties, mini Mastiffs (that one's a mindbender). The Pomsky as a "mini husky" is a good example of this -- all the sass and character of the Husky in a much easier to catch and contain body. This logic often accompanies breedings between vastly different dogs, usually with the aim of using one breed's size as a goal with the other breed's temperament. Sport cross breedings can fall into this trap: the brains of the BC with the smaller structure of the Papillon. But sometimes you get neither of those things. Or you get a weak-kneed, neurotic BorderPap who is 18lbs and 15.5" at the shoulder, and still has to run in a more competitive class in agility. At that point, a Sheltie might have been a better choice.

Like I said, I'm not against purposeful crossing or mixing, but I am against shoddy breeding and predatory marketing. I had to learn these lessons with my first dog, a GSD x Golden who loved people, hated other dogs, and had itchy skin, a bad gut, and sore hips all his life. Genetics play a huge role in temperament, structure, and health. If you are considering a cross, ask yourself:

• is the breeder doing the recommended health testing on the parent dogs?
• what promises about the cross are being made?
• what does the cross improve on from the parent breeds?
• what is the purpose for the cross?

Unfortunately, you are unlikely to find many cross breeders investing in health testing, demonstrating their dogs' attributes, or offering much in the way of buyer support. That doesn't mean they don't exist, but it does mean that finding one is going to take a lot more work than finding a purebred breeder hitting those marks.

If you are looking at shelter dogs, it's also worthwhile considering the breeds assessed as being part of the dog's makeup. Breed guesses are low accuracy for the most part, but if you see a dog marked as a "Lab x Anatolian", it's worth asking yourself if you'd be willing to deal with a dog who might have inherited the least ideal traits of two very dissimilar breeds.

Anyway, back to work for me. Thanks for reading.

Submitted August 09, 2019 at 08:19PM by ardenbucket https://ift.tt/2GXOJMV